jump to navigation

NOTE: The spam filter is being unusually aggressive. If you comment does not immediately appear, it has simply been placed in moderation and I will approve it as quickly as possible. Thank you for your patience.

"Murphy was an optimist!"

The largest terrorist organization ever was an American group May 26, 2009 8:52 am

Posted by Doug McCaughan in : Touchy Subjects
, trackback

Having grown up familiar with this terrorist group, I forget that our children may be completely unaware.

Comments after advertisement

Comments»

1. Json - May 26, 2009

It is a bit disingenuous to fail to note that the KKK as well as all hate and terror groups are soundly denounced by Christians the world over, not to mention that the Christian Bible clearly does not promote such. The same cannot be said for Islam – who’s book clearly promotes conversion at sword-point, and Buddhist terrorists who act with complete impunity among other follows of that philosophy and is something tht is kept well under wraps. But never fear, when Jesus returns it will all be set aright – but don’t think He is coming to take sides, He is coming to take OVER!

2. Doug McCaughan - May 26, 2009

I thought the young man filmed a decent video. I’m sure the KKK were publicly denounced by Christians but that doesn’t change the fact that they were comprised of Christians.

disingenuous – lacking in frankness, candor, or sincerity; falsely or hypocritically ingenuous; insincere

How is his video disingenuous? His video was not an attack on Christians but a reminder that terrorism does not immediately mean a certain religion, sect or social group.

3. Barry - May 26, 2009

I can’t see the video (it’s blocked at work and will try to view it later) so I can’t comment specifically on its content.

But I have to somewhat agree with json (albeit less rapturously) that while many groups and individuals report themselves to the Christians, and as well may even believe themselves to be so, I highly doubt many of these groups or individuals truly espouse and believe in the teachings and word of Christ. Nor do I believe for a minute that a number of these groups and individuals actually carry on the ministry of Christ into the world in the way He wanted them to.

Hatred, bigotry, violence, bitterness, jealousy, spite, pride, vindictiveness, superiority, lying, arrogance…these are some of the traits espoused by some groups that call themselves “Christian”. But can anyone truly believe in their hearts they are following Christ’s example? The KKK and groups like Fred Phelps’ “church” are easy to discern – others a bit more difficult. But whenever a group calling themselves Christian publicly goes out and makes fools of themselves and of Christ, I can’t believe in their sincerity or their true understanding.

Sure, even those who do follow Him do so imperfectly. We all fail, and sometimes spectacularly. But I hope that in their hearts, those who truly and humbly follow Christ can temper their tongues, open their hearts and their minds, exercise tolerance and patience with everyone. Because the ones that don’t – the ones we hear about in the news, and in the history books, and in blogs as well – drive more people away from Christianity with their intolerance and unChristlike attitudes than they could ever hope to “save”.

4. Doug McCaughan - May 26, 2009

Not much to the content of the video It’s just a 1:27 seconds and after json’s comment I had to go read the KKK wikipedia page. I’d say most of the content in the video came directly from wikipedia. Since I was going to be too busy to blog I just grabbed an item off the top of http://popurls.com to post…happened to be this video. I wasn’t trying to incite anyone or even be controversial today.

I would agree with Barry in that those calling themselves Christian then acting unChristlike are misdirected. Christianity kind of covers a spectrum though and no one being entirely wrong or right. For instance, json’s statement “He is coming to take OVER!” bothers me. The churches I grew up in preached the loving, saving Christ..the Savior. I strayed away from the churches that wanted you to fear God. (spectrum fear to love) Everyone practices their religion and their beliefs in their own way. The KKK was primarily Protestant but they were still a hate group. I titled the post off a sentence in the video’s description. Perhaps I should have changed it to simply read “The largest terrorist organization ever was an American group.”

5. Rich Hailey - May 26, 2009

disingenuous – lacking in frankness, candor, or sincerity; falsely or hypocritically ingenuous; insincere

I wasn’t trying to incite anyone or even be controversial today.

Please!

You posted that the world’s largest terrorist group was American Christians and you don’t think that is inciting anything? You don’t think that might be a little bit controversial? Particularly in a time when acts of Muslim terrorism against Christian and Jewish targets are accelerating throughout the world?

You aren’t that naive. And I’m not that stupid.

Once again, in your desire to be “fair” and even handed, you bend over backward to legitimize the truly hateful by demonizing others. In an era when Muslim terrorists are killing Christians and Jews all over the world, you decide to reach back 40 years to cite the KKK. And I know you aware that the Klan hasn’t had any real power in decades because, as you say, your kids are probably not even aware that they existed. Islamic terrorists, on the other hand, are powerful now, and growing in power and in number. Even if the kid’s video was right at one time, that time is clearly past. Hamas, Hezbollah, Al Qaida, Fatah, and the Taliban, just to name the more prominent networks all work together for the same cause, the universal spread of Islam. Islamic extremists far outnumber the Klan, both in membership, and in bloody violence. In the month of April alone, Islamic terrorist have killed over 700 people and injured nearly 1200 more. Since 9/11, Islamic terrorists have killed tens of thousands of innocent victims. Just because it isn’t happening here doesn’t mean it isn’t happening.

Maybe the deaths of thousands of Christians and Jews each year doesn’t bother you, because after all, they’re just Christians and Jews. Maybe you might be more concerned if you knew how many women or homosexuals were slaughtered each year. On the other hand, your search for a false sense of balance may keep you from ever opening your eyes to true evil until you are face to face with it, and it’s too late.

The bottom line is that Islamic terrorists have killed far more people and created far more terror than the Klan ever dreamed of. Your unquestioning approval of this drivel without any conscious thought is beneath you. I believe you are smarter than that, Doug. Get out of your basement and find out what is really going on in the world today.

6. LissaKay - May 26, 2009

So, following this logic then, all Americans are terrorists, right? Or all Americans condone terrorism? I don’t know what you were reaching for with this, but tying Christianity to the very UN-Christian KKK and similar hate groups is offensive. Barry put it very well – Christians are not perfect, by any means, but true believers strive to do what is right, loving and all that gives Glory to His name. Hating has no part in that. They may call themselves Christian, but that does not make it so.

Why does the idea of Christ coming back to take over bother you? It is going to happen one day, and maybe a lot sooner than many of people are truly prepared for. But he is also going to take sides – His believers and the non-believers. What happens to those two distinct groups in those days is detailed pretty graphically in the book of Revelation.

Christians do indeed fear God. It is a good thing, it is part of loving and serving Him. Much like a child desires to please his daddy because he loves and respects him, and fears displeasing him and the consequences that result from that displeasure, Christians want to please God, and they also fear Him and the consequences that come from displeasing Him.

While God is merciful – He sacrificed His only Son so that the world could achieve eternal salvation – He is also wrathful. Some churches have done a huge disservice to their congregations by portraying God to be a loving grandpa-type figure. This is totally wrong, and leads people far astray. It leads them to believe such things as the Bible being just a book of suggestions, to be twisted and turned according to human desire and whim. It leads people to think that they can live their life however they choose and then as long as they say, “I’m sorry, Jesus,” it’s all good. Those poor souls are in for a very rude awakening.

All that is evil will know the full force of His wrath one day. What is evil? All that is not Godly. The KKK and similar hate groups are not Godly. Those who live in sin, in defiance of His Word, are not Godly. All that is against God is evil, and will be destroyed.

7. Doug McCaughan - May 27, 2009

I think you guys are over analyzing this one. I’ve changed the title. Better?

8. Barry - May 27, 2009

One thing I find difficult to put into words is the concept of “True Believers”. For the past couple years, I’ve been reading a great blog where a guy – a Christian – has been analyzing page by page the first two books in the “Left Behind” series. And the movie, as well.

He makes it very clear that the book authors have a distinct view of what a “True Christian” is (in fact, the blogger calls them “RTC’s” for “Real True Christians”, meaning more true than True, i.e. the ones that were raptured). Or, as they assume in the real world, all the Christians that believe as they do in their interpretation of eschatology and End Times prophecy are the actual “True Christians” that will one day vanish from the face of the earth and usher in 7 years of trial and turmoil with the rise of the AntiChrist.

What this means is, I can define (in my heart and head) what a “True Christian” is, and that definition might differ from LaHaye and Jenkins, or Rich and Lissa, or json, or Doug, or whoever. So I hate to use the term because it implies an “I know the True Way and you don’t, so you’re going to hell, neener neener neener ” mentality – when I acknowledge freely I may not know all the answers. And some of the interpretations I believe may turn out to not be entirely accurate. I have faith that God will lead my on the right course to understand the important parts, but I think some people are so bogged down in details and dogma and strict interpretations they forget what’s truly important. And that’s real enough for me.

9. Morgan - May 27, 2009

ROTFLMAO

Your friends are absolutely hilarious!

Share this with your kids!

The Ramones – The KKK Took My Baby Away

10. Missybw - May 27, 2009

And of course they are overanalyzing it… they always do. More righteous than holy is what my sainted Nana would call it. And that’s one of the many facets of life in east TN that I won’t miss. But then again, you know that.

11. LissaKay - May 27, 2009

Well done, ladies … right on time and utterly predictable.

Morgan, you just go ahead and laugh while you can. But it does nothing to hide your intolerance, bigotry and hate. Just why is it that you find it necessary to be like this towards Christians? It is very telling that you cannot just live and let live. Do we really pose such a threat to you?

And Missy? There is nothing wrong at all with being righteous. If you knew the real meaning of the word, or knew what it means to have that gift from God, you would understand this. I don’t think you have very good grasp of what holy means either.

The fact that both of you attempt to mock Barry, Rich and me says far more about you than us. Yet, you still offer nothing to refute anything we have said here. I would challenge you both to prove anything we have said here to be wrong, but I don’t want Morgan going off again and trashing up Doug’s place, nor would I want to seem to encourage Missy to lie again (and about someone she doesn’t even know!) – it’s a sin to lead another to sin.

I do hope and pray that you are called out of the darkness and into the light of His Grace. It’s really awesome out here. I hope you have the chance to know this joy and peace someday.

12. Rich Hailey - May 28, 2009

Doug, Critical thinking is not over-analyzing. But I’ll bite. What was your purpose in posting this piece, if not to provoke comment, thought, or, God forbid, analysis?

A few facts while I wait…

The claim that Klan membership peaked at 6 million is simply ridiculous. A more common estimate is 4-5 million, and that is based on the figure of 15% of the eligible population, a claim made by the Klan. Even that number is inflated,as the 1920 census showed 31 million males 18 and over. Subtracting ineligible males drops that number to around 18 million. 15% of that number gives under 3 million. Additionally, most of those members left the organization as soon as the terror began. Remember, the second Klan was organized as a fraternal service organization,and most members were not there for violence or hatred. Compare that to Hamas,or Hezbollah. The more people they kill, the more people rush to join.

Also, during the 9 years the second Klan was in operation, they were responsible for 416 murders. While that is horrible, Islamic terrorists kill almost twice that many people every month, Doug. They deliberately target the weak and defenseless and their stated goal is the subjugation of every man woman and child on the planet.

There is simply no way to compare this to the KKK.

So why did you try?

13. Rich Hailey - May 28, 2009

Barry, do me a favor and go back and read some of the first columns slacktivist wrote on LB. I started following him the first time you recommended him, but I quickly realized that his grasp of eschatologyy was tenuous at best. It was readily apparent that his aim was to destroy premillenialism as a doctrine, not just the Left Behind book. And if he had to tell a few fibs along the way, well, the end justifies the means.

Here’s a simple example from his first few articles.

He mercilessly mocked Lehaye and Jenkins for the character of Raymond Steele,working to demonstrate what a poor choice he was to demonstrate the “RTC.” They pointed out that his faithfulness to his wife was due to a lack of balls rather than true belief,and that his actions after landing the plane were ineffective and in vain, dwelling on the incident where he upbraids a junior pilot for wanting to ride to the terminal. He continues to make fun of this characters actions and decisions, and indicates exactly how poorly he reflects on the ideals of a good Christian.

Of course, had he been a good Christian, Steele wouldn’t have been left behind, now would he? He would have disappeared along with his wife and family. Steele was NOT a good Christian; that’s the precise point that Lehaye and Jenkins were making. Raymond Steele appeared to be a good Christian on the surface, but he had never made the decision to give his life to Christ. Also, these early scenes were designed to show that despite his efforts to do good, because Steele was basically a selfish man at heart, every effort he made was in vain. Without the grace of God, man can do nothing good. The fact that slacktivist totally failed to pick up on this bit of fairly standard doctrine tells me that his intent was to bash the books in every way possible, rather than give an intelligent theological critique of them. His snide jabs at the writing skills of LeHaye and Jenkins merely confirmed that impression. I stopped reading fairly quickly, although I did respond to a couple of his posts. I found it very interesting that his most vocal fans were atheists and agnostics.

I have some issues with the eschatology of the two authors, but at the same time, anyone who doesn’t believe that Salvation is a gift of God and wholly unearned by our works has not seriously read the Bible. Going further, I believe that anyone who mocks those who “search the Scriptures to see if a thing is so” as Paul so strongly recommended, is in serious danger of blaspheming the Holy Spirit. The book of Revelation specifically tells us that it is a prophecy of the end times, and it is the key with which we can unlock the other prophetic passages, particularly those in Matthew, Daniel, and Isaiah.

We are told by Peter that no prophecy comes from someone’s own interpretation. We are also called to “rightly divide the Word” and to exercise discernment. Sitting back and accepting your own ignorance is not an option. Remember Rev 3:16 “So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth.” I understand you don’t want to offend anybody, and I admire that, but the truth is that we are living in a very critical time, and it is supremely important to get it right,and that means that there will be some who get it wrong. If they don’t know that they’ve got it wrong, they’ll see no need to change,and then they’ll be with the ones talked about in Luke 13:27 “But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ ”

Doug, sorry for preaching in your space, but this is important.

14. Doug McCaughan - May 28, 2009

Rich you are welcome to preach in my space anytime just as others are welcome to have their say.

“What was your purpose in posting this piece” Tuesday I had a very heavy day of coding that began early and ended late. I wasn’t going to get to do any blogging. I paused briefly at a milestone and glanced at the top items on http://popurls.com (my Internet vice). This video was at the very top of the page. I watched the video for a minute and a half and thought the guy made an interesting factual presentation. I particularly liked his setting. (After reading the Wikipedia article on the KKK I now think he took all of his information from Wikipedia.) I took about 5 seconds beyond that to contemplate that we typically consider domestic terrorists to be the unibomber types, solo or small numbers but that indeed the KKK was terrorist group so I thought I’d share the video. God and Christianity never passed through my mind in posting this. I simply grabbed a sentence from his video description and went back to coding. This was a “hey remember our history” not a “let’s attack the Christians” post.

I’ll admit that sometimes I post inflammatory or shocking material because it gives me giggles. This was not one of those times.

I’m not qualified for religious debate so I try not to stir those fires. I’ve been to so many churches that there is one part of the Lord’s Prayer that I just mouth because I never know if I’m a debtor or trespasser. Did you know that there are 3 different versions of the Ten Commandments?

On serious posts, I try to do a little research and fact checking. I didn’t think this one deemed a need for fact checking but after the comments started I did go check Wikipedia to make sure his information was accurate.

15. Dan - May 28, 2009

I realize I’m a little late to the party here, and I’m on lunch break so I have to be brief – but basically the problem is with labeling the KK Kan American Christian terrorist group? Seems to me that the facts are indisputable; they’re American, they’re Christian, and they’re a terror group. If your argument is that that they just happen to be Christian and that doesn’t factor into why/how they hate, I would note that that hasn’t stopped us from labeling Al Qaida, et al, as ‘Muslim’ terrorist groups, even though their motives and stated goals are as far from Islam as the KKK’s are from true Christianity. Can’t eat your cake and have it too, people.

16. Morgan - May 28, 2009

LissaKay,

I can tell now that you live to fight with others on the internet. You are pretty good at provoking people, I’ll give you that. I still don’t think anything of yours I’ve ever read has made me really believe you are as full of love and peace as you claim. I looked on your blog and even one of your friends said your blog was full of venomous ranting and raving yet somehow they think god has changed you. But I don’t see it.

I did not attack you, I only said that Doug’s friends made me laugh. That is all. And though you want so badly to be a martyr for jesus and play the victim, what makes me laugh has nothing to do with you being a christian.

If you want to think I hate christians (which you do), I can’t change your mind.

17. LissaKay - May 28, 2009

Dan – You are incorrect when you say that the goals of Al Quaida and similar groups are not in line with Islam. They are. It is the stated goal of Islam to convert, kill or enslave every last man, woman and child on the face of the Earth. Learn a bit more about Islam; I recommend Robert Spencer, or Walid Shoebat – a former PLO terrorist who converted to Christianity. It is not what groups like CAIR want you to think it is.It is the antithesis of Christianity.

Morgan – good heavens, child. You are so terribly confused and misguided. I feel so sorry for you. Honestly. What you call fighting on the internet is really discussion or debate. That’s part of why blogs exist. It would be very boring if everyone always agreed. People can disagree with each other and still be friends, you know. If what I say is provocative, then it has the weight and impact of being truthful. If I was just blowing smoke, no one would pay attention, would they? It certainly causes a reaction in you, doesn’t it? Yet, you offer no factual argument against what I say … only mockery. Very telling …

FYI – Christians are not just about kittens and butterflies, you know. We get angry too. My friend that left that comment stood by me while I went through a huge battle to save my children from being harmed any more than they already had been. Did I get angry about what was happening to them? Oh yes, indeed I did. I ranted at length at the person that was causing the majority of the harm to them – their father, who is supposed to be their protector and defender, not their abuser – both on my site and with my friends. It was not a mindless rant or rage at life in general, it was a righteous anger, directed at a particular person who more than deserved it.

Even Jesus Himself got angry. He even kicked some butt while he was at it. He is the only human to live in perfection – so if He got mad, then it isn’t always a bad thing.

But my friend is right that I am more at peace now – my faith has strengthened and deepened over the years, and because of that, my blessings in life have increased.

Did I say here that you attacked us? No, I did not. I noted that you attempt to mock us. Key word there, “attempted” … you do not have what it takes to do any sort of harm to Christianity or our faith. No one does. I defend Christ not for you, but for others that might read those words, to keep those words from engendering doubt in others who may be in the process of coming to Christ. You are often wrong about Christians and what we believe and how we live our lives. Your hatred is just glaring though. Previously you said that you “loathe conservatives and Christians” … you do know that loathe is a synonym for hate, right? So, I am just taking you at your word.

I continue to pray for the day when the Lord places His hand on your shoulder and pulls you from the clutches of darkness that you are now in. I hope that day is sooner, rather than later.

18. you asked for it - August 12, 2011

christian terrorism and terrorist groups.

Sons of Freedom/freedomites

Russian National Unity

Russian National Socialists

The Boeremag

The Warriors of the Boer Nation

Aryan Nations

God’s Army

Lega North

Fronte Combattente Cristiano or ‘Fighting Christian Front

Christian Identity Movement

All Tripura Tiger Force

The Continuity Irish Republican Army, otherwise known as the Continuity IRA (CIRA)

Irish National Liberation Army (INLA

The Irish People’s Liberation Organisation)

The IRA (Irish Republican Army)

The Loyalist Volunteer Force (LVF)

The Red Hand Defenders (RHD)

The Orange Volunteers (OV) or Orange Volunteer Force (OVF

The Official Irish Republican Army or Official IRA

The Provisional Irish Republican Army (PIRA)

The Real Irish Republican Army, otherwise known as the Real IRA (RIRA)

Red Hand Commando

Saor Éire

The Irish People’s Liberation Organisation

All Tripura Tiger Force

The Real Ulster Freedom Fighters, otherwise known as the Real UFF

Continuity Irish Republican Army

The Ulster Defence Association (UDA) & it’s other wing organisation The Ulster Freedom Fighters (UFF)

The Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF

The National Liberation Front of Tripura (or NLFT)

Cumann na mBan

Fianna Éireann

Klu Klux Klan

the Manmasi National Christian Army (MNCA)

The Holy Spirit Movement (HSM)

The Lord’s Resistance Army (also Lord’s Resistance Movement or Lakwena Part Two)

The Iron Guard

L?ncieri

Army of God

The Lambs of Christ, also known as Victim Souls of the Unborn Christ-Child

Hutaree

The Covenant, The Sword, and the Arm of the Lord (CSA)

Montana Freemen

Nagaland Rebels

Tsar Lazar Guard

White Eagles (paramilitary)

christian terrorist Group in Poso, Indonesia

The Guardians of the Cedars

The Phineas Priesthood movement.

The Serb Volunteer Guard (SDG)/Arkan’s Tigers

Oklahoma Constitutional Militia

Christian Patriots

Christian Knights

The Lebanese Forces (also known as the Christian Phalangist Militia)

The Concerned Christians

christian with 50/50 political/religous motives

Oklahoma City bombing Perpetrator(s) Timothy McVeigh, Terry Nichols, Michael and Lori Fortier

Rexism

Interahamwe (because the whole hatred is based on the christian idea of hamitic people and all the members are christians)


trackback